One of the best parts of traveling...
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| St. Peterskirche, Zürich |
... is the chance to see the world in new ways. Every time I travel, I always see anew and come across wondrous things that rattle around in my brainpan for months afterward.
As one might say, in a turn of phrase widely attributed to Issac Asimov,
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds new discoveries, is not “Eureka!” (I found it!) but “That’s funny…”
As you know, I've just returned to Silicon Valley from my sojourn in Zürich. It was a wonderful time, full of fascinating places, cultural traditions, and an immersion in a culture that is not my own, but marvelous to behold.
But, as you might expect, I noticed a few funny things that drew my attention--things that I need to share with you as SRS Challenges.
Can you figure these out? (I don't think they're that hard, but they ARE incredibly interesting.)
1. In the picture of St. Peterskirche (above) there's something about the clock tower that struck my eye and made me say, "That's funny..." Does it strike your eye too? Can you find an explanation for it? (No, it's not leaning.)
2. All around Zürich I kept running across places that had this logo (below). They always seem to be centered around a coffee shop / diner of some kind, but they seem to be much more than just another coffee shop. What are these places? Why would one go there?
3. I was lucky enough to see one of these wee beasties flying over a clump of flowers and sipping nectar, looking for all the world like a hummingbird. But it's NOT a hummingbird! What is it? (I wish this image was mine, but none of my shots turned out. This is from Wikipedia.)
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| A mysterious flying critter. What is it? P/C Wikimedia |
4. You know the quote above that's reputedly by Asimov? I have my doubts. Can you figure out where it actually comes from?
As always, please tell us your findings in the comments below. BE SURE to tell us what you did to find your answers.
About Q1, the tower for me has three interesting things. I don't know if it's the one Dr. Russell noticed.
ReplyDeleteAt the top, the kind of flag. Then the device that looks like kitchen bell.
And finally the now closed squares. It looks like maybe the tower was a barn?
About Q3, that animal brings good memories for me. I asked about when Dr. Russell gave the first Search MOOC. Plus I also thought it was a hummingbird. In real life they are much more similar when you see them.
It's a Hummingbird Moth. And it's a great experience to see both pollinating. Hummingbirds and Hummingbirds moths in the same Lantana is magical
After reading about the IIII with Remmij, searched [why St. Peterskirche clock roman numbers]
DeleteGoogle AI generated version gives much information.
IIII was additive and also people write that is easy to read and maintain balance with VIII
Then [First Roman Numbers]
Wikipedia: Big Ben has Roman Numbers
Also says: The notations IV and IX can be read as "one less than five" (4) and "one less than ten" (9), although there is a tradition favouring the representation of "4" as "IIII" on Roman numeral clocks. Links to web Archive and Washington post (behind paywall)
https://web.archive.org/web/20201115002205/https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/arts-post/post/public-clocks-do-a-number-on-roman-numerals/2011/11/04/gIQAenKllM_blog.html
Hola Ramon, good thing Dan didn't spot one of these "wee beasties" in Basel - he was safer in Zurich...
DeletePanasian Hummingbird Basiliskmoth (Macroglossum stellaswisstarum)
https://i.imgur.com/Qtnc96F.jpeg
they are hard to photograph/capture.
Thanks Remmij. Yes they are hard to photograph. Another difficult to take photos are swallows. They are beautiful too.
DeleteWith [st. Peterskirche zurich unknown facts]
Now in renovation
https://www.disfrutazurich.com/iglesia-san-pedro
11 Things You Didn’t Know About Zurich... Turicum and many more
https://globalheartbeattravel.com/facts-about-zurich/
I wonder if Dr Russell found Turicum name in an ancient construction or something like that. I read some brands still use that name
Out of topic, and related to previous Musical Challenges. Plus I am sure Dr Russell and hopefully more will like this musical instrument. It's new for me. Is it new for you?
DeleteTheorbo. In Spanish, Tiorba
https://youtu.be/NjUEAvgZqSE?si=FIL9WE4ST9yh25Ul
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theorbo
As an early music fan, I certainly know about theorbos. (Like a lute, but with an extended neck for very long bass strings.) They are very, very cool. The video you linked to as a demo is a great example.
Delete#1-
ReplyDeleteAI overview:
"The numerals on the clock face of St. Peterskirche in Zurich are Roman numerals. The clock face itself is notable for being the largest church clock face in Europe, measuring 8.7 meters in diameter.
One specific detail that some people notice is that the number four on the clock is represented as IIII instead of the more common IV. "
#2 - (google lens)
https://gz-zh.ch/stiftung/portrait/#wer-wir-sind
#3 -
https://es.theepochtimes.com/article/el-color-de-las-flores-que-eligen-los-polinizadores-que-tan-importante-14264.html
#4 - odd... “Hey, wait a quasar….”
https://quoteinvestigator.com/2015/03/02/eureka-funny/
#IIIII - nur zum Grinsen
https://i.imgur.com/YwiVEV8.jpeg
Hi Remmij
DeleteI didn't saw the iiii until you mentioned!
I read about the tower and the story is as Dr Russell said, very interesting. It served as a fire watch post so had 360 view. Also interesting was to read how the clock has been changing the mechanisms. And the two owners of the church.
I also didn't notice the 4 question. I love so much hummingbirds that I thought that was the final one.Or my eyes blocked the rest.
New things to searchresearch for me
also AI overview off a standard search, re:#1 -
Delete"While Roman numerals generally use IV to represent 4, some clocks and watches use IIII instead. This practice, often called the "clockmaker's four," is believed to have originated for aesthetic and practical reasons. Some theories suggest it creates better visual balance with the VIII (8) on the opposite side of the clock face. Additionally, IIII is sometimes preferred because it avoids using the first two letters of Jupiter's name (Iuppiter), which was avoided out of reverence"
another IIII use -
https://hsm.stackexchange.com/questions/15004/gate-44-at-the-colosseum-in-rome-xliiii-or-xliv-when-and-why-the-change
https://imperiumromanum.pl/en/roman-art-and-culture/roman-numerals/#google_vignette
https://blog.pocketwatchdatabase.com/2021/03/13/exploring-the-origin-of-roman-numeral-iiii-instead-of-iv-on-watch-dials/
re: #3 - may be headed your way?? (invasive?)
Deletealso AI overview -
"While some hawk moth species are native to the United States, the Spurge Hawk Moth (Hyles euphorbiae) is an example of a hawk moth introduced to help control an invasive plant, leafy spurge. It was deliberately introduced in Canada and some western states, including Montana, for biocontrol purposes. The moth's larvae feed on the leafy spurge, reducing its growth. Other hawk moths, like the White-lined Sphinx Moth, are native to North America. There have also been recent reports of a possible introduction of the Eurasian Hummingbird Hawkmoth (Macroglossum stellatarum) in northern California. "
https://forum.inaturalist.org/t/possible-introduction-of-macroglossum-stellatarum-in-northern-california/35756
About the clock - I didn't notice the 'IIII'. All I could think that seemed funny was the hands of the clock centring on a window. Not sure I've see that before...
ReplyDeleteThe 'bird' certainly looked a bird, but then I saw the antennae and thought it can't be. (But why will a bird not have an antenna ever?)
Finally, thanks for rhe interesting post!
thought it was odd that I couldn't find a view from inside the clock tower/clockworks...
ReplyDeletehttps://www.newlyswissed.com/4-best-views-from-the-roofs-of-zurich/
out at the limits of AI training...
"St. Peterskirche in Zurich is famous for having the largest church clock face in Europe. While information about the church's history, the size of its clock face, and its role as a fire watch tower until 1911 is readily available, detailed images or virtual tours specifically showing the inside of the clock tower and its intricate clockworks are not widely published or easily accessible through general search results. Most results focus on the exterior, the history of the clock and church, or general visitor information.
Therefore, I cannot provide a detailed image of the interior clockworks of the St. Peterskirche clock tower based on publicly available information."
"Europe's Largest Clock Face: St. Peter's Church in Zurich is famous for having the largest church clock face in Europe, measuring 8.7 meters (as of 2023) or 28 feet in diameter.
Interior Details: Descriptions of the church interior focus on the main pulpit, choir chairs (dating back to the 13th century), baptismal font, and stucco work. There are also references to remnants of an older fresco in the apse.
Function as Fire Watch: Interestingly, the tower was used as a fire watch until 1911. This suggests that the interior of the tower would have been functional, designed to allow watchmen to see a 360-degree view of the city.
Limited Public Access to Tower Interior: Although you can visit the interior of the church nave, the sources don't explicitly state that the public can go inside the clock tower itself to see the mechanism or the interior workings of the clock. Climbing the tower of other Zurich churches, like the Grossmünster, for views is mentioned, suggesting that access to St. Peter's clock tower interior might not be a typical visitor experience.
Photos: While images of the church interior are available online, specific images depicting the inside of the clock tower itself (beyond glimpses of the clock face) are not prominent in the search results provided.
In summary: The interior of the St. Peterskirche clock tower would likely consist of the mechanics of the large clock and potentially a space used by the fire watch in the past. However, direct access to the tower's interior for public viewing is not clearly indicated in these results. The focus is primarily on the vast clock face and the church's interior features. "
see #5 for mural remains - some inside views...
https://i0.wp.com/www.teachertrekker.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/Zurich2-74.jpg
https://www.teachertrekker.com/zurich-switzerland-self-guided-walking-tour-part-2/
interesting details - clock now run by computer and dual ownership of the church...
https://www.st-peter-zh.ch/4.php?read_category=2650
https://www.instagram.com/stpeterkirche/
some construction views -
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCn4jx82cehWh9acyMcKqjhQ
tours -
https://st-peter-zh.ch/-4/die-kirche~3064/-geschichte-artikel~3229/turm--zifferblatt/63103/
AI gets multiple things wrong visually, including the 'IIII'
ReplyDeletehttps://i.imgur.com/GMGPRb5.jpeg
The image shows the clock tower of St. Peter's Church in Zurich, Switzerland. St. Peter Church is the oldest parish church in Zurich, with its original foundation walls dating back to the 9th century.
Its clock face, measuring 8.7 meters in diameter, is the largest church clock face in Europe.
The church tower was historically used as a fire watch post until 1911, offering a 360-degree view of Zurich.
The tower houses five bells from 1880, with the largest weighing over six tons.
The church is currently undergoing renovations and is expected to reopen in October 2025.
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monumentaluhr
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6851875/EU-votes-scrap-clock-changes-2021-leaving-countries-choice-daylight-saving-time.html
was looking at some info on Don Norman and ran across this -
ReplyDeletehttps://www.interaction-design.org/literature/topics/wicked-problems
thought "wicked problems" might tie in with "Unanticipated Consequences" & "Paradoxes of the Unexpected" and what Don describes as "complex socio-technical systems."
You probably have absorbed all this, but thought it might be of interest...
That's right--wicked problems are a particular kind of problem for which Unanticipated Consequences play a big part. Good catch.
Deleteregarding wicked...
Delete"A wicked problem is a concept in planning and policy-making that refers to a class of problems that are highly resistant to resolution. The term was introduced by design theorist Horst Rittel and city planning professor Melvin Webber in the 1970s. The "wicked" in "wicked problem" doesn't imply evil, but rather that the problem is malicious, tricky, or extremely difficult to solve.
Here are some key characteristics of wicked problems:
No definitive formulation: You can't fully define the problem before solving it, and the understanding of the problem often changes as you try to address it. Different stakeholders will have different, often conflicting, views on what the problem actually is.
No stopping rule: There's no clear criterion that tells you when the problem is solved, as solutions often lead to new, related problems. It's an ongoing process of management rather than a one-time fix.
Solutions are not true-or-false, but better or worse: There's no objectively "right" or "wrong" solution, only approaches that are more or less effective, or that create different sets of trade-offs.
No immediate or ultimate test of a solution: The consequences of interventions can be far-reaching and take a long time to manifest, making it difficult to assess their true impact.
Every solution is a "one-shot operation": Because of the complexity and the irreversible nature of many interventions, trial-and-error learning is difficult or impossible. Every attempt counts significantly.
No enumerable set of potential solutions: There isn't a finite list of possible solutions, and new approaches might emerge at any time.
Every wicked problem is essentially unique: Even if problems appear similar, their specific context, stakeholders, and interdependencies make them distinct.
Can always be considered a symptom of another problem: Wicked problems are often interconnected within complex systems, so addressing one might reveal deeper underlying issues.
The choice of explanation determines the nature of the problem's resolution: How a problem is framed significantly impacts the solutions considered.
Planners have no right to be wrong: Those attempting to "solve" wicked problems bear significant responsibility for the consequences of their actions, even if unintended.
Example of a Wicked Problem: Climate Change
Climate change is a quintessential wicked problem because it exhibits all these characteristics:
No definitive formulation: Is it primarily an energy problem, an economic problem, a social justice problem, or an environmental one? Different groups define it differently.
No stopping rule: There's no single point where we can declare climate change "solved." It requires continuous adaptation and mitigation efforts.
Solutions are better or worse: There's no perfect solution; various strategies (e.g., carbon taxes, renewable energy mandates, geoengineering) involve complex trade-offs with economic, social, and political implications.
No immediate test: The effects of climate policies often take decades to fully materialize, making it hard to definitively prove the success of a particular intervention.
One-shot operations: Building a new power plant or implementing a carbon pricing system has massive, often irreversible, consequences.
Unique: While climate change is global, its impacts and the most effective mitigation strategies vary significantly by region and community.
Symptom of other problems: It's linked to issues like poverty, resource scarcity, global trade, and consumption patterns.
Planner liability: Governments and policymakers face immense scrutiny and responsibility for their climate actions (or inactions).
Solving wicked problems doesn't mean finding a single, perfect answer, but rather engaging in ongoing, collaborative efforts to manage and mitigate their effects through adaptive strategies and a deep understanding of their multifaceted nature."
couldn't many of the "wicked problems" be solved by the elimination of Boston & Matt Damon?
Delete"The term "wicked" as used in the Boston area, functioning as an intensifier (meaning "very" or "extremely" as in "wicked cool" or "wicked smart"), has a somewhat murky but distinctly New England origin.
Here's what research suggests:
Ancient Roots, Modern Usage: The word "wicked" itself dates back to the 13th century, possibly from Middle English "wicke" or Old English "wicca," originally meaning "evil" or "morally wrong." This traditional meaning is seen in phrases like Shakespeare's "Something wicked this way comes."
Transformation to Intensifier: The modern New England usage, where "wicked" functions as an adverbial intensifier, is believed to have developed regionally. One hypothesis suggests it evolved from the Puritan practice of attributing an intense quality to a "curse or supernatural force." For example, something "wicked hot" might have been perceived as so hot it seemed the result of a curse. This transformation is seen as similar to how other adjectives like "awful" or "terrible" historically became intensifiers (e.g., "awfully good," "terribly hard").
When it Became Widespread: While there are some earlier examples (like in 17th-century English plays), the widespread use of "wicked" as an intensifier in New England, particularly Massachusetts, didn't truly take off until the 1960s. It became very common among teens and young adults in the region during the 1980s and 1990s.
Popular Culture: The term gained national and even international recognition, largely thanks to popular culture. The film Good Will Hunting (1997), set in Boston, famously used the phrase "wicked smart," solidifying its association with the Boston accent.
Regional Identity: Today, "wicked" is a strong marker of New England identity, especially for Massachusetts and Boston. While some local dialect terms fade, "wicked" has shown remarkable staying power. It's almost always used as an adverb to modify an adjective (e.g., "wicked good"), rather than as an adjective itself (e.g., not "wicked car" to mean "cool car," which would be considered incorrect by many New Englanders).
So, while the exact moment it transitioned from its traditional meaning to its modern slang usage isn't pinpointed to a single event or person, it's firmly rooted in the linguistic evolution of Eastern New England speech, becoming a defining characteristic of the Boston area's vernacular."
wicked -
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/N8vhv2Uinto
https://youtu.be/mhFGdEwden0?si=wXrYbNiptw_cKRmH
and then there was this... Boston & the rest of MA - wicked gone.
https://didoisux.wordpress.com/2013/02/01/death-by-crushing-peine-forte-et-dure/
super-hyper mega wicked problems -
Deletehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wicked_problem
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Encyclopedia_of_World_Problems_and_Human_Potential
the past:
https://youtu.be/-cjZyqxyqIk?si=Q65qlCa1bz4LVvCq
Asimov -
ReplyDeletehttps://rb.gy/96a87s
https://earlymusicmuse.com/bosch2/
ReplyDeleteon the right -
https://i0.wp.com/earlymusicmuse.com/wp-content/uploads/2030/01/Bosch_HellVanityGluttony-scaled.jpg?ssl=1
flight of the Valkyries? apparently a wind instrument.
https://i0.wp.com/earlymusicmuse.com/wp-content/uploads/2030/01/Bosch_HellBirdmanBirds.-scaled.jpg?ssl=1