Wednesday, July 26, 2017

SearchResearch Challenge (7/26/17): Milking the milk topic...

Not many weeks ago... 

... I was visiting some family in Wisconsin, land of the dairy farm. 

(A generic Wisconsin dairy--not my family's farm.)  
That made me start thinking about milk and a few related topics came to mind.  

The first thing I remembered was my experience with milk as a child.  I grew up in Los Angeles in a gilded age when the milk was delivered to your home by the milkman.  You'd leave a note for the milkman--say, "2 quarts whole; 1 pint cream"--and then the next morning, the order would appear. The milkman and his truck were a common early morning sight in the US, back in the day.    

Usually, the milkman would leave it on the doorstep, but the really nice houses had a kind of built-in receptacle to hold the milk and keep it out of the sun.  

But in earlier days, milk seems to have been delivered in a totally different way.  Here's an image I've had in my files for a while--from an era even earlier than the days when I was a kid in LA.  

Seeing the Belgian woman pouring the milk into a bowl reminded me of a visit to my sister's house where she had a traditional milk container.  You've seen them before--they look like this: 

All of this recent milk sightings has made me wonder a few things--great SRS Challenges for us to work on this week!  

1.  Those milk containers (as seen in the previous image):  Do they have a specific name?  If I want to buy one, what term or name would I search for?  Is it possible to buy new ones?  

2. As I said above, some houses had a kind of mini-closet into which the milkman would put the day's delivery:  What was that mini-closet called?

3.  Milk delivery by dog?  Seems odd to me--why use dogs to deliver the milk?  In particular, can you figure out where that image of the dog-cart milk delivery came from?  What other kinds of animals were (or are) used to deliver milk to the customer?  

4.  Milk generally comes from cows, and we have a lot of them in Wisconsin and California.  But what other animals produce milk that's widely used as human food?  That is, I know whales produce milk too, but it's not really a common food item.  Which kinds of animal milk is used as a food product?  (Extra credit just for fun and a surprise: Which four states are the top milk producers in the US?)  

Hope you find this dairy-focused Challenge to be as fascinating as I did!  

(Remember:  I'll come back again in a week, August 2, to give my solution to this Challenge.  I'm off to Mexico to do a bit of research for future SRS Challenges!)  

Search on! 


  1. 1. First attempt was wrong with a search for [ milk tanks ]. It gave big industrial tanks.

    Second attempt was also wrong (sort of). Searched for [ milk urns ] and Google returned a Search Engine Results Page (SERP) for Milk Churns. Yes you buy new and used.

    2. We had one in our house. We would get into the house through it when we were locked out and a lot smaller. Search [ Milk Chute ].

    3. Had to change this up a bit to avoid animals delivering milk via glands etc. or mail delivery. Adding the word cart helped. Search [ animal cart milk delivery ]

    4. Search [ animal milk is used as a food product ]

    Extra - Search for your original question [ Which four states are the top milk producers in the US? ]

  2. 4. Clearly its humans first. Then after cows, goats, sheep and here on Vancouver Island its water buffalo in particular the riverine variety first domesticated in Italy. Just about every food store stocks water buffalo yogurt, cheeses and meats. They are beautiful creatures. jon

  3. Replies
    1. Yep.. The Chocolate milk Challenge. (I *liked* that one!)

  4. Replies
    1. I hadn't seen the Adohr farms milk truck accident (with Sutro Tower in the background). That's a great find.

    2. sorry Dan, that version of the SF Adohr (Rhoda) Stutz Pak-Age-Car mishap only existed in my imagination… an event that only happened on the internet, bypassing reality…
      kinda like these @ the 'Plex… ;-)
      Shirley Temple and two calves at Adohr Farms, circa 1937
      Adohr Farms Collection
      Sutro Tower - Construction commenced in 1971, completed in 1973
      Adohr truck accident - 1951
      "The accident occurred in the middle of St. James Park. Various models of cars are parked on the street in the background. Photograph dated January 13, 1951."
      Adohr SERP

    3. who would have guessed milk would have led to this…?
      a little risqué, but even Fischl seemed aware of the Adhor milk accident and may have included in this 1982 "untitled"
      painting… think it's the Dodgers & Angels on the screen, but hard to tell (and it is an April 1 date)
      almost looks like Jeff Koons had a hand in this
      has a little Mark Tansey feel too - he was born in San Jose…
      E. Fischl
      speaking of Aprils…
      or KAWS
      note Snoopy
      has a KAWS connection…
      "Things really took a sharp turn when I saw the Mark Tansey retrospective show at LACMA in the early 90’s."
      Jean-Pierre Roy
      R. Mutt appears in Karl's town
      Karl says hey

  5. Post 1 of 2

    3. Milk delivery by dog? What other kinds of animals were (or are) used to deliver milk to the customer?

    Searched by image the photo.

    [dogs company milkman] result related to Q2

    [milkman delivering milk dogs] in All and Images

    Images show more dogs delivering milk (Dog cart)

    2017: Do you know the milkman? Dairy delivery thrives in Fort Collins

    Why has the traditional milkman vanished and what was it like in his heyday? Horses mentioned to deliver the milk.

    [milk delivery dog cart]

    Wikipedia: Dogcart (dog-drawn)

    Books confirm that dogs were used to deliver milk and mention most of times treated with cruelty.

    [dog cart milk through history]

    Dog Carts and the Extinction of Memory

    Answer: Not sure if you ask about where the image you showing come from. Dog carts came from: France, Belgium and The Netherlands. Also some images from California. Other animals used were houses and even the cows.

    4. But what other animals produce milk that's widely used as human food? (Extra credit just for fun and a surprise: Which four states are the top milk producers in the US?)

    I know about goats and sheep

    [animal milk used for human consumption]

    Milk drinking started around 7,500 years ago in central Europe “...goat and sheep milk…”

    Wikipedia:Milk Food product for humans Also: What is milk? With that definition Soy is not milk, it is beverage.

    Answer: From Wikipedia: cattle, sheep, goats, yaks, water buffalo, horses, reindeer and camels.

    For extra credit: [top milk producers united states]

    California, Wisconsin, New York and Idaho”...Wisconsin is also known as ‘Americas Dairyland’, engraved on its licence plate

    U.S. Milk Market - Statistics & Facts”... In 2015, worldwide milk production amounted to about 816.69 million metric tons...Major producers of cow milk worldwide in 2015 ( EU, USA, India...Mexico in 9th place)

    [top milk producers Mexico] and [mayores productores de leche en México]

    México produjo 11.6 millones de toneladas de leche de bovino al cierre de 2015, el 2.5 por ciento de la producción global el mismo año.

    Los estados productores más grandes de leche de bovino son Jalisco, con 2,157 millones de litros en 2015; Coahuila, con 1,380 millones de litros, y Durango, con 1,142 millones.

    1. And, for Mexico, the highest producing states are: Jalisco , with 2.157 million liters in 2015; Coahuila , with 1.380 million liters, and Durango, with 1,142 million liters .

  6. Post 2 of 2

    Hello Dr. Russell and everyone

    1. Those milk containers (as seen in the previous image): Do they have a specific name?

    As we had a Milk farm asked my dad and in Spanish the name is Peroles. And also known as botes lecheros

    Searched by image the containers

    [old milk containers name]

    Wikipedia: A milk churn is a tall, conical or cylindrical container for the transportation of milk. It is sometimes referred to as a milk can. In pails link says: “Pails made of wood, and later metal, were originally used to transport milk, before the introduction of the milk churn.”

    Milk Bottle

    Answer: They are called churn.

    2. As I said above, some houses had a kind of mini-closet into which the milkman would put the day's delivery: What was that mini-closet called?

    [milk delivered in the past]

    Remember the Milkman? In Some Places, He’s Back (2007)

    Cows in homes and comment mentions: “Pryanico Milko-Box” Part of Q3

    Nostalgia for an old-fashioned milk bottle

    Also interesting the book “No Milk Today: The Vanishing World of the Milkman By Andrew Ward . Searched “Churn”, “pails” and others. Also mentions other data

    link to the book

    [where milkman put milk in old houses]

    Even though they were called milk chutes they were also used to deliver other products such as eggs, bread and vegetables/fruits.

    Answer: Milk Chutes

    1. Remembering our previous SRS Challenges with trees, I just read the story about another one. Quina, el casi extinto árbol medicinal del escudo de Perú que ni los patriotas conocen e inspiró el gin tonic I didn't know about this.

  7. hope this doesn't sour… at least check the link about Dubi*…
    guessing that is past the sell-by date - 7,500 years ago
    s b d
    past sell by?? the stores need to toss the B.C. stock, just sayin
    the cow milk alternative… doubt the cow is a fan…
    now, a tourist thing… damn tourists
    WB Milk: some Bay examples
    4 years to get into the black - Tomales, California operation
    sad followup
    NYT piece
    seems to be ongoing - in your neighborhood/area… maybe you have tried?
    double 8 dairy - there's a video in the 'About' - make gelato - Sonoma County
    a possible place to taste… all in the name of sRs, of course
    and in WI, they pray – "Every morning, I'm singing to them, praying to God it will go OK" "Ayalon knows he should be afraid of the powerful, 1-ton bull named Armando, sired by a water buffalo in Italy.
    "One day, he will kill me. He knows it. I know it." "Ayalon said he's heard the cheese is really good. But he's never tasted it, and probably never will, for one simple reason: "I don't eat cheese.""

    Dubi Ayalon

    the cheese
    from Israel to Wisconsin
    *Dubi's tale (a former Lt. Colonel) voice & story - a good story, a worthwhile 17 minutes… he has a coarse speech pattern – Hello Buffalo, hey buffalo
    … hopefully there is some honey in the mix too… and good olives & dates…
    and now, Water Buffalo Cheddar
    can fried WB curds be far behind?
    I'm off to find some pseudo milk…
    some observations
    "Let's just say that that night, that smelly, rancid night on a Greyhound bus in Pennsylvania, I learned the hard way the true horror of Yoo-hoo™. It is not a beverage. It is a concoction, devised by witches, brewed in a swamp, and taste-tested on the seventh level of hell."

  8. 1. [Milk can] works fine for used and new sold here Also called churns

    2. [milk delivery door] found milk box as general name and Pryanico Milko-Box as a specific product which has arrows inside that can point to what you want.

    3. Images says Illustrated London News / sketches in Germany cant read date

    4. 2015 data California (by far) Wisconsin, Idaho then New York. Source is NASS/USDA 2015 Summary

    Composed in EditPad

  9. In the Netherlands en Belgian we still use this milk containers [ in Dutch: "melkbussen]

  10. Replies
    1. Great links, Remmij!

      I was searching for the photo and found:

      [perro entregando leche]

      Antique KEYSTONE Photo 1900s DOG TEAM Delivering Milk Belgium

      [Belgium dog team delivering milk]
      Dog Carts with photos

      [Keystone View Company]

      Wikipedia: The Keystone View Company was a major distributor of stereographic images, and was located in Meadville, Pennsylvania. From 1892 through 1963 Keystone produced and distributed both educational and comic/sentimental stereoviews, and stereoscopes.

      Also tried searching the initials on the photo without luck. Then tried search by image adding "woman milk seller dog cart" and found link that mentions the book you already share

    2. … even back in the old cart days, it was all about los gatos…
      they ruled the pre-internet too…
      and then there was the cart-less, fresh milk delivery system… pre-social media.
      milk delivery

    3. Love the stereo image of the dog cart and milk delivery.

  11. … that would curdle the milk… so that's what the silos are for…
    a bad day & a good day at the dairy

  12. Replies
    1. ✩officially, sufficiently miked…✩ in 2 parts:
      even fake milk news…
      'smell of scientists'
      real news - 150 gallons per day!!
      Orca milk
      "I once had killer whale milk. I'll starve to death before I have that again. It tastes like fish. It's got like 15 times more fat than cow milk."
      ""SeaWorld's domestic breeding program, in addition to frequent testing of pH levels to see when female whales are ovulating, also stores plenty of killer whale milk in case a mother rejects her calf. Apparently, the staff used to taste the milk, and nobody gave much thought to that. Those days are definitely over.

      U of IL, Lactation Biology Website - Providing fundamental information about the biology of lactation in mammals.
      cow anatomy
      a small scale goat dairy example
      camels - a frothy beverage
      getting the technique
      camels in TX
      the trickle down of politics on camels in the Gulf
      Daily Mail article, disturbing - Qatar blockade
      and evolving
      from 2010 - Survival of the fattest
      it may not bode well…

  13. errant lunar transmission… Neil visits Joe's old place
    sometime between July 20 & now
    sRs Friday, May 30, 2014
    "3A. How long would it take you to find a picture of Neil Armstrong standing on the moon that was published in The Guardian newspaper sometime in the past 30 years? "
    moving pictures
    Saturn 500f
    Mt. Marilyn, the feature Jim Lovell named for his wife
    lower center

  14. 1. I still have a few of these in the garden at home. We call them milk pails or milk churns. They are known by different names in different parts of Australia. Until the 1930s you left a “billy” at your front gate and the milkman transferred the milk from the churn into your billy. By 1934, this was replaced by bottles due to public health concerns- I found plenty of references to this in old newspapers kept by TROVE (National Library of Australia). You can still buy them today from our local agriculture coop as well as lots of garden centres.

    2. According to TROVE, they are called Tradesmen’s hatches or delivery hatches- here is a report from Women’s World in 1928

    3. To find the origins of the picture, I did a reverse image search and limited the search time to June this year to take out any references to this search challenge that were swamping my search results. According to a Flickr collection The World's Best Photos of dogcart and dogs : “Image taken from page 164 of '[The World's Inhabitants; or, Mankind, animals & plants ... With ... illustrations, etc.]' (The British Library)” For the range of animals once again, I can draw on experiences first- I have been on carts/carriages/sleighs drawn by horse, oxen, donkey, sheep, dog, reindeer, goat and camel. My favourite was a skilift in Italy, being towed by a horse and cart: A Google image search [unusual animal drawn carts] reveals that this is a fertile field for Pinterest pages. I found several- but the most prolific was this one
    4. To find the different types of animal milk consumed by humans I started off my search analog rather than digital. I happen to own a copy of Harold McGee’s On Food and Cooking where he lists Human, Cow (European breeds and Zebu), Buffalo, Yak, Goat, Sheep, Camel Reindeer and Horse. He also describes the composition of Fin Whale milk, so I did a Google search [fin whale milk]. This led me to a report that staff at Seaworld used Orca milk but I think this could be an apocryphal story- I’ll dig deeper when I have more time. The related searches at the bottom of the SERP suggested whale milk icecream- among the results for this search were an announcement from the Penny Ice Creamery that they were now making whale milk icecream- note the date and this fascinating article from Munchies where they interview Dr Young Park, who has written a book called Handbook of the Milk of Non-Bovine Animals. He adds moose, llama and pigs to the list.

    As an aside I found this lovely video

    1. the 'The story of a milk cart' video was a great find and touching story with Katie clip clopping…
      Thursday, 23rd July 1987
      LPD cart
      in the collection, associated with LPD
      Conway Tighe and Ian Buckles
      Lincoln Park on GooMaps - 70 Lincoln Rd, Essendon, Vic - dairy location
      being built over now…
      interesting cross-reference -
      see #48 - Hugh Tighe
      sRs on traffic signals -
      Feb. 2015
      a Canberra Times piece
      Catriona Donnelly

      fwiw, the whale milk link - "It's official: We're making blue whale's milk ice cream through a special arrangement with the Monterey Bay Aquarium"
      is an April 1st post - also in the comments:
      "This seems to along the same vein as the London Ice Creamery Baby Gaga that is selling Human Milk ice cream for $22.50 per 11 ounces. Blue Whale Ice Cream, YUMMY! LITSC (leave it to Santa Cruz). Or is this a great Aporil Fool's joke???" … those Blue Whales are verrrrry hard to milk ;-)

      NMA twitter

    2. Thanks for the notes... and the link to the Pintrest page is great. (Pintrest is often a great source of images in a given category.)

      Also.. that IS a great video. Thanks for the link.

    3. How to milk an Orca -- the YouTube video (from SeaWorld, San Diego)

  15. 1. These are milk cans which can be bought today by searching [stainless steel cream or milk can]. For this search I started with [vintage milk container] which brought up listings for “milk cans.” But, there was a problem. Those listings were selling decorative milk cans. So, I refined my question to ask whether a serious milk can is still sold. Under Google’s suggestions for related searches there was a really nice phrase [dairy supplies milk cans]. I clicked and the first result was Hamby Dairy Supply where you can purchase a milk can that a true dairy farmer would be proud to own.

    2. These mini-closets are called milk doors, milk chutes, or milk boxes. After many tries, a search for [milkman home refrigeration system] pulled up a source describing “double doored milk cubbies” but that was a mouth full. Using that phrase, another search for [double door milk cubbie milkman] referenced the actual names in the description of the result. The term “milk chute” seems the most targeted and commonly used by architects to describe the feature in old buildings.

    3. Dog carts were used to transport goods when stronger animals were too expensive or the wagon needed to navigate narrow or populated streets. Other animals that hauled loads were horses, donkeys, mules and oxen. A few sources under the search [dog cart milk delivery] explained that this practice was often used in specific European countries. So, I narrowed my search to just one country, [dog cart netherlands], which pulled the source I used. Problem is, it’s difficult to verify the credibility of this source or just generally, how this information was collected by the authors.

    4. Cows, goats, sheep, buffalo, and camels produce milk used in dairy products as wells pigs, poultry animals, rabbits and horses, but this milk is less commonly used. A search for [animals that produce milk humans] pulled up a literature review done at the Swedish University of Agricultural Sciences that had this information in the abstract. Finally, stats pulled from the search [milk production by state] cite the top producers as California, Wisconsin, New York, and Idaho.